Legislature(1997 - 1998)

02/11/1997 10:15 AM House MLV

Audio Topic
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
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             HOUSE SPECIAL COMMITTEE ON                                        
            MILITARY AND VETERANS AFFAIRS                                      
                  February 11, 1997                                            
                     10:15 a.m.                                                
                                                                               
                                                                               
MEMBERS PRESENT                                                                
                                                                               
Representative Beverly Masek, Chair                                            
Representative Joe Ryan                                                        
Representative Pete Kott                                                       
Representative Eldon Mulder                                                    
Representative Richard Foster                                                  
Representative Reggie Joule                                                    
Representative Irene Nicholia                                                  
                                                                               
MEMBERS ABSENT                                                                 
                                                                               
All members present                                                            
                                                                               
COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                             
                                                                               
OVERVIEW:  Department of Military and Veterans Affairs                         
                                                                               
SENATE JOINT RESOLUTION NO. 7                                                  
"Supporting continued funding of the Alaska National Guard Youth               
Corps Challenge Program."                                                      
                                                                               
  - SJR 7 MOVED OUT OF COMMITTEE                                               
                                                                               
PREVIOUS ACTION                                                                
                                                                               
BILL: SJR  7                                                                   
SHORT TITLE: AK NAT'L GUARD YOUTH CORPS CHALLENGE PROG                         
SPONSOR(S): SENATOR(S) PHILLIPS, Pearce, Leman, Mackie, Green,                 
Kelly, Parnell, Ellis, Hoffman, Ward, Sharp, Wilken, Miller,                   
Duncan, Lincoln, Halford, Torgerson; REPRESENTATIVE(S) Rokeberg,               
Grussendorf, Brice, Bunde, Ryan, Kubina, Masek, Mulder Ivan, Kott,             
Ogan, Croft, James, Green, Kelly, Cowdery, Davies, Porter, Kemplen,            
Berkowitz                                                                      
                                                                               
JRN-DATE      JRN-PG                 ACTION                                    
01/14/97        41    (S)   READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRAL(S)                  

01/14/97 41 (S) STATE AFFAIRS

01/23/97 (S) STA AT 3:30 PM BELTZ ROOM 211

01/23/97 (S) MINUTE(STA)

01/24/97 124 (S) STA RPT 5DP

01/24/97 124 (S) DP: GREEN, MILLER, MACKIE, WARD, DUNCAN

01/24/97 124 (S) ZERO FISCAL NOTE (DMVA)

01/28/97 (S) RLS AT 11:09 AM FAHRENKAMP RM 203

01/28/97 (S) MINUTE(RLS)

01/29/97 160 (S) RULES TO CALENDAR 1/29/97

01/29/97 161 (S) READ THE SECOND TIME

01/29/97 161 (S) ADVANCED TO THIRD READING UNAN CONSENT

01/29/97 161 (S) READ THE THIRD TIME SJR 7

01/29/97 161 (S) COSPONSOR(S): PEARCE, LEMAN, MACKIE,

01/29/97 161 (S) GREEN, KELLY, PARNELL, ELLIS, HOFFMAN,

01/29/97 161 (S) WARD, SHARP, WILKEN, MILLER, DUNCAN,

01/29/97 161 (S) LINCOLN, HALFORD, TORGERSON

01/29/97 162 (S) PASSED Y19 N- E1

01/29/97 164 (S) TRANSMITTED TO (H)

01/31/97 182 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRAL(S)

01/31/97 183 (H) MLV, STATE AFFAIRS

01/31/97 207 (H) CROSS SPONSOR(S): ROKEBERG,

01/31/97 207 (H) GRUSSENDORF,

01/31/97 207 (H) BRICE, BUNDE, RYAN, KUBINA 02/07/97 277 (H) CROSS SPONSOR(S): MASEK 02/11/97 (H) MLV AT 10:00 AM CAPITOL 17 WITNESS REGISTER MG Jake Lestenkof, Adjutant General/ Commissioner Department of Military & Veterans Affairs P.O. Box 5800 Ft. Richardson, Alaska 99505-5800 Telephone: (907) 428-6019 POSITION STATEMENT: Presented overview of Military & Veterans Affairs JIM CHASE, Director Special Affairs Department of Military & Veterans Affairs P.O. Box 5800 Ft. Richardson, Alaska 99505-5800 Telephone: (907) 428-6019 POSITION STATEMENT: Participated in overview of Military & Veterans Affairs GARY PEDERSON, Col, Director Alaska National Guard Youth Corps Department of Military & Veterans Affairs P.O. Box 5800 Ft. Richardson, Alaska 99505-5800 Telephone: (907) 428-6067 POSITION STATEMENT: Participated in overview of Military & Veterans Affairs JERRY BURNETT, Staff Senator Randy Phillips Alaska State Legislature Capitol Building, Room 103 Juneau, Alaska 99801 Telephone: (907) 465-4949 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on SJR 7 ALICIA PORTE-THOMAS P.O. Box 670431 Chugiak, Alaska 99567 Telephone: (907) 688-0426 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on SJR 7 ED EARNHART 1043 W 74th Street Anchorage, Alaska 99518 Telephone: (907) 349-1160 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on SJR 7 ACTION NARRATIVE TAPE 97-1, SIDE A Number 022 CHAIR MASEK called the House Special Committee on Military and Veterans Affairs meeting to order at 10:15 a.m. Members present at the call to order were Representatives Ryan, Kott, Mulder, Foster, Joule and Nicholia. Chair Masek invited Representative Norman Rokeberg to join the committee members at the table. Representative Ivan Ivan joined the proceedings at 11:00 a.m. Number 174 GENERAL JAKE LESTENKOF came forward to present an overview of the Department of Military and Veterans Affair. The General introduced his staff in attendance: Carol Carroll, Director, Administrative Services; Nico Bus, Chief, Financial Services; Gary Pederson, Director, Youth Corp.; Jim Chase, Director, Special Affairs. He then stated that a military conference would be taking place the following day which all the committee members were invited to. GENERAL LESTENKOF stated that he would cover some of the highlights about the department. Military and Veterans Affairs (MLV) is the largest department in state government with about 4500 employees located in 76 communities throughout Alaska. Thirty four percent of the department consists of Alaska natives. About 22 percent of their Air Guard consists of females. MLV consider themselves to be a very important, basic industry leveraging over $150 million annually from the federal government. They look at the Guard and their department as an investment center which generates hundreds of millions of dollars and provides important stabilizing infusion of funds into communities throughout Alaska. GENERAL LESTENKOF stated that the department's federal funds amount to about $153.9 million which is leveraged by about $7.4 million of state funds. He said he wanted to concentrate on the department's economic value and how the state benefits from this. The department adds significant value to the nation, to the state, to the communities and the Alaskan people. The Army and Air Guard perform vital, real world operational missions as an integral part of their national military defense forces. The Division of Emergency Services provides an essential system for disaster planning, recovery, mitigation and prevention. Planning is very important especially in Alaska where they have large parts of the state in an unorganized status. Number 460 GENERAL LESTENKOF noted that the Guard is one of Alaska's premier leadership, professional, technical and vocational training institutions, improving career and job skills for both urban and rural Alaskans. Their Youth Corp Challenge program is the center piece of the Governor's Children & Youth Task Force solutions for at-risk youth. The Army and Air Guard Rescue Units saved 110 civilians during 1996 while training for their wartime missions. The Guard armories throughout Alaska serve as multi-purpose community facilities. The Guard carries on a proud tradition of service to Alaskans that date to World War II and the Eskimo scouts. GENERAL LESTENKOF added that the department is organized in line department, with the Army Guard, the Air Guard, the Division of Emergency Services. On the state side of the House they have some support divisions such as the Administrative Division and the Facilities Division which maintains all the state's facilities. Their federal support staff divisions include their Property and Fiscal Office which is the Accountable Federal Office in the state for all federal property. They have a personnel office, an IG (Inspector General), EEO (Equal Employment Officer) and their JAG (Judge Advocate General) offices are all located within the federal staff support division. Finally, they have special programs which they run, like the Youth Corp Program, the Naval Militia, the State Defense Force and lastly the Veterans Coordinator Office (VETS), which is for veterans. Number 660 GENERAL LESTENKOF referred to the hand-out provided to all the committee members and mentioned their counter drug program. The Department runs about a $3 million counter drug program which is federally funded in Alaska. They participated with about 45,000 youths last year in stressing the dangers of drug use within the school system along with other agencies. Also, working with civil authorities they participated in the capture of drugs worth $64 million. Number 711 GENERAL LESTENKOF noted the Guard payroll impact in Alaska. Their total payroll comes to about $90.2 million. Using the gross economic multiplier of 2.27 factors out to about $204 million generated just in payroll through the Guard programs in the state. He considers the department as an investment center for Alaska beginning with their federal mission for their military units. This is a basis for how they bring in the federal dollar. This organization connects with the state's missions through the emergency responses which they conduct. This in turn helps the Alaskan people. The department needs state support and that's the reason why they come before the committee for the important part the committee plays in funding the department. When state support seems strong it makes his job easier at the Washington D.C. level in lobbying for the better units that they want for Alaska. Number 840 GENERAL LESTENKOF continued that this partnership for Alaska supports the governor's and the legislature's priorities for jobs, economic development, for children and education, etc., along with the philosophy of budget discipline. He knows that the legislature and the administration is interested in supporting basic industries in Alaska. He quoted Neil Fried from the Department of Labor when speaking about Alaska industries and jobs, "Military money is worth more to the state because it comes from the outside. It's bringing new economic activity into the economy. The rest of America is paying us to help defend them. In a sense we are profiting from that. We're an exporter of defense. We don't make stuff like tanks. We export protection." GENERAL LESTENKOF added that if they were a private sector employer this is how they would compare. They have approximately 4200 employees compared to CARRS at 3200, Providence Hospital at 1900, ARCO at 1900, Fred Meyer at 1700, VECO at 1500, WalMart at 1200 and Alaska Airlines at 1200. He also wanted to touch upon Arctic Care which is a military operation they've run for about two years. It is a program which consists primarily of marine reserve units that work with the National Guard. They go into Nanana area villages with medical teams. This year they will visit the Bethel area and provide medical assistance including physicals, dental examination, etc. Over 4,000 villagers have been treated during the past two years by this Arctic Care Program. Number 1025 GENERAL LESTENKOF pointed out that connected to Arctic Care is Arctic Engineer program. Working with Reserve Guard units they have been able to do some engineering work. The big project they've undertaken thus far is the expeditionary air strip installed at Noorvik this past summer. The previous airstrip was eroding into the river and it was slated to be replaced four years from now. The Marine Engineering Unit went in and built an expeditionary air strip. A big project slated for this summer is the construction of a 14 mile road on Annette Island at Metlakatla. This road will connect the community to a ferry landing 14 miles away. Number 1115 GENERAL LESTENKOF presented three areas of concern in closing, the first being, the Youth Corps. The Youth Challenge Program was authorized for three years by Congress as a pilot program. This will expire this fiscal year 1997. They need authorization badly and noted that he had been on capitol hill to promote the program. The Defense Department supports it and has endorsed a reauthorization of the program. Towards this end they've placed $20 million as a place holder in the President's budget which was delivered last week. They understand that their problems may lie in the U.S. House and he noted that the Senate appears to be supportive of it. The General said that along with 15 other states they intend to send a letter to the four appropriate committees in the House and Senate supporting reauthorization legislation. GENERAL LESTENKOF continued that his second area of concern was with the largest division in the Department, the Army Division, with over 2000 people it is presently without a division director. This position has yet to be authorized and they'd like to see this happen during this session. Because they have no full time director, the General finds his time used up a lot with this important division. GENERAL LESTENKOF concluded with reference to the Quadrennial Defense Review (QDR) which is mandated by Congress. This is a review presently taking place within the Defense Department. This is a review of the entire military community of America and it will take place during the next four or five years. The General referenced previous reviews, but stated that this review was very significant since it will truly look at America's military forces based on the Post Cold War world. It is a review which will take into account the type of force America requires for the future. A new twist to this review is that as part of the requirements they will establish a National Defense Panel consisting of civilians to review the QDR and to make recommendations to Congress and the President. The General said that they could end up with a small active component and a large reserve component. America is a militia nation and he noted that our founding fathers did not want a large standing army, but America has had a large standing army since the Cold War. Number 1397 REPRESENTATIVE RICHARD FOSTER mentioned that the Military and Veteran's Affairs Committee was formed in 1991 and now the Senate doesn't have a committee like this. This committee provides a forum for the General's department. He then noted how many present legislators have served in a branch of the armed forces. This number is at 11 this year. Number 1475 REPRESENTATIVE JOE RYAN asked about the Director's position for the Army Division that needs to be filled and asked if this Range 26 position was in the Governor's budget this year. GENERAL LESTENKOF stated that the position was deleted and he didn't know why, either because of budget cuts or whatever. Number 1533 REPRESENTATIVE ELDON MULDER offered as a partial answer that General Tom Carroll wore several hats a few years back, this position being one of them, and after his plane went down it left a void. Number 1580 JIM CHASE, Special Assistant to the General provided information to the committee regarding Special Affairs at the request of Representative Foster. He stated that he was brought on board August of 1995, to basically follow up on the Board of Inquiry to ensure that all of the recommendations which came out of this forum were implemented. He put together a program to do this and a report regarding the same was drafted as well. They changed a lot of the things that were still pending in the Board of Inquiry, they provided a sunset provision for this title and incorporated those items not completed to their continuous quality plan. This quality plan is on-going. Number 1627 REPRESENTATIVE REGGIE JOULE asked about the Base Realignment and Closure Commission (BRAC) impacts to rural Alaska. He saw the listings of the reductions regarding this Commission and asked what the reasons were for these reductions. Number 1639 GENERAL LESTENKOF noted that these changes came about for the following reasons, number one, at a point in time during the 1980's, the Guard was over-structured. The force was larger than what the population could support in Alaska. Presently, on the Army side, their strength requirement is at about 2,200. In the 80's this number as at 3900. This is a big difference. In recognition of this, the units were required to be downsized. The other consideration which came into being was based on the experiences of the Gulf War. There, units were mobilized with standards that were a little different in the reserve. The Guard components instituted by the Defense Department there consisted of different standards that were adhered to as well. These standards hit hard in Alaska. The General did note that there were some waivers in place such as education and so forth, especially within the scout units, but that these standards hit hard and had an impact on Alaska's force. GENERAL LESTENKOF summarized that drug testing was the final consideration. A few years ago marijuana was legal in Alaska. When drug testing was instituted then they ran into problems. This eliminated people and units. These three events had a lasting impact on Alaska. They drug test 42 percent of the Army force today. The results coming back are very encouraging. Number 1784 REPRESENTATIVE JOULE asked if once a person has tested positive whether or not there is a time period when this person can be retested and then potentially re-instated. GENERAL LESTENKOF responded that if someone who is an E4 and below can stay with the force provided that they are tested periodically and they stay clean. If someone is an E5 or above, otherwise called a buck sergeant or an NCO (Non-Commissioned Officer), once they test positive they are dismissed. They would probably not be able to come back into the force. He reminded the committee that they're dealing with a volunteer Army where sometimes there is a waiting list to get in. The standards are high and they must be maintained. Number 1844 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER asked what the "wash out" rate was when someone first gets tested, in other words, what percentage test positive. MR. CHASE responded that the recruiters he spoke to report out of every 10 people that they ask whether or not that person has taken drugs answer yes. Their inventory of possible people to bring into the force is very narrowed by the rampant use of drugs throughout the state. REPRESENTATIVE MULDER stated that out of this 70 percent of the interested population to join the Guard for recruitment there remains a fairly narrow slice of the pie. Number 1898 REPRESENTATIVE JOULE noted that for those who "get the thumb," it seems that if these young people saw there was a way for someone who commits this digression was given the opportunity to get re- instated, this would provide them incentive to clean up their act. Number 1934 GENERAL LESTENKOF responded that once someone is tested positive and discharged they will probably not come back in. He said he would check to make sure that this was the correct response. The Reserve components, including the Guard do not have a re-hab program like the active services have. If someone tests positive in these programs there is someone there to assist them. REPRESENTATIVE IRENE NICHOLIA stated that she had read an article which indicated that the persons enlisting in the armed forces is down and asked how this has impacted Alaska. GENERAL LESTENKOF remarked that Alaska seems to lag behind any trends. In Alaska, recruitment has been steady and even, especially in Southeast. Numbers have been high. Number 2039 REPRESENTATIVE NICHOLIA noted that it used to be in earlier years when a person committed a misdemeanor sometimes they were sentenced to join the Armed Forces and she asked the General what he thought about re-instating such a policy in Alaska. GENERAL LESTENKOF responded that she was exactly right. For many years in America, for minor offenses, a judge would ask an individual if they wanted to go to jail or into the service. This policy was very successful in many cases, but not any more. Alaska really has no influence in the matter since people are enlisted under the federal service. The requirements are getting stiffer, even if someone has a minor offense they cannot enlist. This is a big concern with the Alaskan villages since a lot of people there have run into the law and acquired minor offenses. GENERAL LESTENKOF added that the closest thing they have to this concept is their "Challenge Program." This program almost functions in the way that Representative Nicholia described where young people with minor offenses were able to come into the military service, now they are able to direct them into their youth programs even before they get into real trouble. Number 2121 REPRESENTATIVE NICHOLIA asked what some of these minor offenses would be. GENERAL LESTENKOF stated that any drug offense would be one or felonies for certain. REPRESENTATIVE NICHOLIA asked if a minor consuming would be one of these offenses. Number 2167 COLONEL GARY PEDERSON, Director, Youth Corps came forward to address this question. He stated that with the number of individuals who do enlist he works with the recruiters regularly. Each of the services do have different rules. Currently the Air Force is the most stringent, the Navy is the least stringent. A minor charged with consuming alcohol would preclude them enlistment into the Air Force. This offense would currently put someone on a waiver status for the Army and the Navy. The Navy will consider someone under these circumstances, but the Army will not. GENERAL LESTENKOF offered to provide the committee with an informational sheet on what's allowed for enlistment presently. REPRESENTATIVE RYAN asked how they could assist the department with recruitment as a cost saving measure and mentioned the Youth Program in particular. Number 2300 COLONEL PEDERSON responded that their most productive source for marketing of new young people coming into the program are prior graduates. This is where most of their assessment comes from, through work with their own peer groups. They promote public service announcements as well. By the National Guard Bureau regulations they are not allowed to expend monies in the media specifically for recruitment because they don't want to send the message to young people to drop out of school in order to join the Youth Corps. Direct recruiting may be seen this way. They market towards the already dropped out or expelled population. They work very closely with school counselors, as well as with counselors in juvenile corrections when they decide who will go on probation. The young person cannot be currently legally entangled though. COLONEL PEDERSON stated that the pool for possible recruitment will probably be up to 4,000 alone in the immediate future and they haven't had the impact on these numbers they would like. They do have an impact if they can get in the door. There needs to be another means of getting to these youngsters based on the number of possible recruitments. He also added that they don't represent an "easy way" which might keep youngsters away from the program. Number 2401 REPRESENTATIVE RYAN stated that Alaska spends a lot of money within the educational system and others to determine "at risk" populations. He said that since these funds are being spent there should be a database established to help identify these youths. COLONEL PEDERSON responded that they take children from each class now and export them. He said they don't have the transportation funds to take youngsters into the non-Anchorage and Mat-Su Valley areas to allow for peer type exposure. Many of the schools in these areas are working with the program through the school counselors. They target their "at risk" students and then someone from the Corps will peer counsel them about viable options. He said this same type of program should be marketed into places which cannot be driven to by automobile, but he said that this was very expensive. Number 2468 REPRESENTATIVE JOULE stated that there is currently legislation proposed which will relax juvenile confidentiality constraints. He asked if these concepts should become law. TAPE 97-1, SIDE B Number 000 COLONEL PEDERSON responded that the confidentiality rule does come up depending on what grade and who they deal with. Some counselors are very reluctant because of a grey area as to whether or not they are committing a violation of the law by referring names to the Youth Corps. This is a valid concern. REPRESENTATIVE JOULE noted that in the larger communities, specifically Anchorage, as well as with the entire state, there is apparently concern with adolescence at the ages of 12 to 16 years who lack discipline. He suggested that the Youth Corps target this age group. COLONEL PEDERSON responded that they have a four week test program developed in concert with the Anchorage police department. They have not been able to execute this program due to lack of funds and they've been attempting to acquire a grant. Number 090 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER asked what the cost of this program would be. COLONEL PEDERSON responded that he didn't have this figure in front of him, but he'd provide it at a later time. Number 106 CHAIR MASEK perceived that there were quite a few topics of concern brought up by the committee members and she noted that they could probably schedule another hearing to discuss these further. She stated that she'd like to hear from each member as to what areas they'd like to pursue in order to aid youth programs, including targeting drug and alcohol problems throughout the state, as well as ideas on how to get more youths involved in order to help get them back on track. Number 127 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER offered that in the past, every couple of years, Representatives have taken tour of the Guard facilities throughout the state. This allows people to get a first hand idea of what the Guard is all about and how it impacts all Alaskans. It is also an opportunity to recognize the good work of these posts. SJR 7 - AK NAT'L GUARD YOUTH CORPS CHALLENGE PROG Number 268 JERRY BURNETT, Staff to Senator Randy Phillips, Sponsor of SJR 7 came forward to testify. This legislation was introduced to send a strong message of support for the National Guard Youth Corps Program to the U.S. Congress. Mr. Burnett stated that the committee heard from the General information regarding the need for continued funding of this program which ends in September of this year. The committee also heard about the program from Mr. Pederson and felt as though there was not much he could add to the testimony already presented. MR. BURNETT explained that the governor's budget for FY 98, includes a $250,000 increment for state support at the recommendation of the Governor's Cabinet on Youth and Justice. The Senator has discussed the fact that some other states are contributing state money to similar programs. This shows a good faith effort as the state solicits more funds from the federal government. Some states have budgeted this year to participate as high as a dollar to dollar match. He didn't know if there was an average of participation throughout the states. GENERAL LESTENKOF added that the state's participation as a pilot project is normally an exception rather than the rule. Mississippi is one state that matches dollar for dollar and there are four others that participate with lesser amounts than a match. Number 348 REPRESENTATIVE PETE KOTT asked how many other states participate in similar programs and whether or not Alaska was competing for the $20 million. MR. BENNETT said he believed there were 21 other states. GENERAL LESTENKOF added that there were a total of 21 states which participate in this program. Fifteen run a peer challenge program like Alaska. The $20 million he spoke about that the defense department has put in as a place holder until authorization comes through is only about half of the amount which is needed nationally. They feel that $47 million is required to support 15 states. Number 413 ALICIA PORTE-THOMAS testified by teleconference from Anchorage on SJR 7. She stated that she was a strong supporter of the Youth Corps. She graduated from the last class and she's currently in the Alaska National Guard Youth Air Guard. In April she'll be attending boot camp and currently works for the Youth Corps. She joined the Youth Corps because the school system was not working for her and decided to join rather than drop out. She graduated from the program with honors and was Corps Commander while attending. She strongly urged the committee's support. Number 550 ED EARNHART testified by teleconference from Anchorage on SJR 7. He is on the Advisory Council for the Youth Corps and he's very concerned that they do what they can to get support for this program. He was also concerned about the slimmed down federal monies mentioned and felt as though Alaska should designate even more money than the Governor has, to show support in Washington, D.C. Number 709 REPRESENTATIVE FOSTER moved and asked unanimous consent to move SJR 7 out of committee with individual recommendations and accompanying zero fiscal note. Hearing no objection, SJR 7 was moved out of the House Special Committee on Military and Veterans Affairs. Number 740 REPRESENTATIVE JOULE asked about how funding for the Youth Corps might be faced with troubles from the House on the national level and asked what federal committees would review these budgets. GENERAL LESTENKOF stated that the committees in the House would be the National Security Full Committee and the Appropriating Committee to the National Defense Committee. Also, there is the Arms Services Committee in the Senate, the Appropriations Committee in the Senate and the Defense Subcommittee in the Senate. He noted that from all indications it seemed the Senate supports this program, but there may be some resistance from the House. Number 792 CHAIR MASEK asked if there was anything they could do to aid in the QDR review to let the committee know. She said she'd like to do whatever they could to aid in a favorable review for Alaska. REPRESENTATIVE MULDER added that it would be significant to demonstrate some willingness on the state's part to participate in financing for this Youth Corps program. He noted that the budgets would be difficult this year, especially within Military and Veteran's Affairs, but it would seem logical that since they're providing education to the participants within this program to fund some of this amount from the Department of Education. He said this seemed logical to him because if they don't fund this program through the Department of Education or somewhere, he'd have to fund them in the Department of Corrections Department somewhere down the line. Number 853 REPRESENTATIVE RYAN added that this could be a joint effort, take a little bit from Corrections and some from Education, make everybody happy. He noted that these were cheap dollars invested when considering what's to be funded down the line. ADJOURNMENT Number 871 CHAIR MASEK adjourned the House Special Committee on Military and Veterans Affairs meeting at 11:25 a.m.

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